Mike Powell wrote to KURT WEISKE <=-

Not sure about the unions (since you are getting them off the street)
but I agree with the privatized prisons. That should never have been allowed to happen. Things that make them money, and generate kickbacks for politicians, are always going to come before what is good for the public and the incarcerated.

Agreed. Anecdotally hearing of for-profit prison companies making
thinly-veiled threats about conviction rates being too low for their
profits and contracts is antithetical to society in general.


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Rob Mccart wrote to KURT WEISKE <=-

I think part of the problem with that is a lot of those people want nothing to do with a place where they don't have complete freedom
to come and go and do whatever they want. They prefer being homeless
to having to follow rules.

Yeah, it doesn't take being burned by a system many times to feel safer
on your own.

On another track, I had a thought about poor people that struck me a
while back, it costs less to put someone through College than to put
them in jail. In theory, that would mean that offering free education
to poor people would eliminate generational poverty and reduce crime
rates since they would, in theory, end up with good jobs..

It would cost even less to feed kids while they're in school and provide pre-school during the formative 1-5 years. Extend medicare to those
under 18. See what a healthy, well-fed generation does when they get
their shot.

Then the black cloud starts to form in the back of my mind and
I think, considering they can't get a huge percentage of those
low income people to even finish highschool, would an offer
like that do any good for more than a small percentage?

Just a random thought.. (and see 'Colour and Paint' above)..

---
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While I agree that incarceration *in jails* doesn't work, putting them in

>mental hospitals seemed to work better than what we do now... ignoring a
>lot of them until it is too late... and I would like to see us go back to
>that.

I'm not suggesting I know what's best but I'd wonder if a mental
hospital is the best place for someone who, in theory, can't be
cured since it's part of who they are. This started off with talk
of dangerous sexual preferrences so.. Trying to 'cure' a Pedohpile
is a bit like trying to 'cure' someone of being Gay. They are what
they are and maybe can fake they are now the way you want them to
be (to get out) but you haven't really changed them.

Anything I have said so far is in regard to dangerous/violent offenders,
and my comments were not meant to be restricted to sexual predators... from Kurt's post, I sort of read in that he was talking about all people who
have violent feelings/fantasy towards others, and not only of a sexual
nature.

If they are not offending, or showing clear signs that they will likely
offend, I don't think they need to be put anywhere. If they are offending, they need to be somewhere... jail, hospital. If they are showing
clear signs that they are likely to offend, whether that offense be rape or mass-killing, they need to be off the streets. I don't think jail is a
good place for this latter group as they've not offended yet, but we need
to stop waiting for persons "known to authorities" to offend before they
are either given help or, if the "help" doesn't help, locked away.


* SLMR 2.1a * "Cool! I broke his brain!" - Bart on Principal Skinner
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Saving money is often a big incentive, although your gov't is mostly
shit down at the moment because the more Liberal Democrats don't
want to stop the availability of health care to illegal immigrants,
if we are hearing the story accurately here in Canada.

That, including your typo in the second line, is correct! ;) More
precisely, they don't want the mandate that hospitals must at least
stablize any critical patient (of any legal status) that shows up at their facility... they cannot turn them away... to be nullified.

You'd think Trump would like keeping the health care going so that
as soon as they show up for a medical thing, he could have them
deported..

Yeah, you would have thought he or his cronies would have thought of that. Thing is, it is a talking point that gets his shrinking base excited...
which apparently involves the potential death of anyone not of legal status.

Of course, the possibility that this and other contention points might also threaten their own health plans will not occur to members of "the base."


* SLMR 2.1a * "Gasoline clears my sinuses!" - Fred G. Sanford
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On another track, I had a thought about poor people that struck me a
while back, it costs less to put someone through College than to put
them in jail. In theory, that would mean that offering free education
to poor people would eliminate generational poverty and reduce crime
rates since they would, in theory, end up with good jobs..

Then the black cloud starts to form in the back of my mind and
I think, considering they can't get a huge percentage of those
low income people to even finish highschool, would an offer
like that do any good for more than a small percentage?

Interesting thought! I guess if they qualify for college (i.e. they
finished high school) and are not deemed mentally ill (which I don't
believe they all are), that would be a better use of our tax money in the
long run.

I think it might especially be applicable for those who don't choose to be homeless (i.e. they used to have jobs but COVID, lack of skills, the
economy, etc., but them on the streets). For some of them, it might not
even be a full college degree, as they may already have one, but simply
some vocational training to bring their skills up to date.

"Up to date," of course, is an ever-moving target!

Mike


* SLMR 2.1a * "Kills millions of germs on contract"
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On another track, I had a thought about poor people that struck me a
while back, it costs less to put someone through College than to put
them in jail. In theory, that would mean that offering free education
to poor people would eliminate generational poverty and reduce crime
rates since they would, in theory, end up with good jobs..

It would cost even less to feed kids while they're in school and provide

>pre-school during the formative 1-5 years. Extend medicare to those
>under 18. See what a healthy, well-fed generation does when they get
>their shot.

I guess it's one of those things where you'd not know what would
happen until you tried it. Will it make them want to succeed or
just produce a well fed new batch of criminals?

It's not this way anymore but, at one time in Canada, they made a
point of not putting all the poor people on welfare in the same
area, they would pay more and mix them with middle class people
in the hopes that the often single mothers with children would
grow up looking for something better. I imagine that worked to
some extent but eventually the poor people number so high that
something like that isn't workable..

---
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If they are not offending, or showing clear signs that they will likely

>offend, I don't think they need to be put anywhere. If they are offending,
>they need to be somewhere... jail, hospital. If they are showing
>clear signs that they are likely to offend, whether that offense be rape or
>mass-killing, they need to be off the streets. I don't think jail is a
>good place for this latter group as they've not offended yet, but we need
>to stop waiting for persons "known to authorities" to offend before they
>are either given help or, if the "help" doesn't help, locked away.

It's a tough call, when you just know someone is a time bomb to
hurting or killing others but they haven't done so yet.

Possibly they would benefit from some psychiatric care, which
they would probably have to be forced into, and have the professionals
decide if/when they become safe to let loose on the streets..

---
* SLMR Rob * This is a Tagline mirror>|<rorrim enilgaT a si sihT
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It's a tough call, when you just know someone is a time bomb to
hurting or killing others but they haven't done so yet.

Possibly they would benefit from some psychiatric care, which
they would probably have to be forced into, and have the professionals
decide if/when they become safe to let loose on the streets..

Which is what I think they used to do.

Mike


* SLMR 2.1a * "Einstein? Who's he? Another troublemaker?" - H.Baines
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Saving money is often a big incentive, although your gov't is mostly

>> shit down at the moment because the more Liberal Democrats don't
>> want to stop the availability of health care to illegal immigrants,
>> if we are hearing the story accurately here in Canada.

That, including your typo in the second line, is correct! ;)

Ha.. My subconcious at work ? B)

More precisely, they don't want the mandate that hospitals must at least

>stablize any critical patient (of any legal status) that shows up at their
>facility... they cannot turn them away... to be nullified.

Yes, even ignoring illegals, you hear about people without insurance
dieing in hospital parking lots at times. The high cost of healthcare
causes a lot of issues in every country trying to supply it as a
social service for everyone, not just the rich.

You'd think Trump would like keeping the health care going so that

>> as soon as they show up for a medical thing, he could have them
>> deported..

Yeah, you would have thought he or his cronies would have thought of that.

>Thing is, it is a talking point that gets his shrinking base excited...
>which apparently involves the potential death of anyone not of legal status.

His popularity is dropping, is it?

Of course, the possibility that this and other contention points might also

>threaten their own health plans will not occur to members of "the base."

My nephew (in law?) was saying tonight how things were getting better
in the USA, and I was saying that's not what I seem to be hearing.
He also insists that anything I hear on the news is Fake News and
can't be believed so..

I simply said I haven't heard too many americans saying how their
cost of living is getting a lot cheaper since Trump took office..
(Correct me if I'm wrong..)

The news here said the other night that most of the profits coming
in from Tariffs is going to reduce taxes for Millionaires, and
it's being paid for by the regular people, who are the ones who
pay the tariffs, not those who sell the products there.

---
* SLMR Rob * WARNING - Removal of this tagline prohibited by law
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On another track, I had a thought about poor people that struck me a

>> while back, it costs less to put someone through College than to put
>> them in jail. In theory, that would mean that offering free education
>> to poor people would eliminate generational poverty and reduce crime
>> rates since they would, in theory, end up with good jobs..

Then the black cloud starts to form in the back of my mind and

>> I think, considering they can't get a huge percentage of those
>> low income people to even finish highschool, would an offer
>> like that do any good for more than a small percentage?

Interesting thought! I guess if they qualify for college (i.e. they

>finished high school) and are not deemed mentally ill (which I don't
>believe they all are), that would be a better use of our tax money in the
>long run.

Even if they were given educational loans at low or no interest as
long as they stay in school and get passing grades, they should
make so much more money later than they would have, they'd be able
to pay it off. And generally speaking, if parents have a college
degree, they make sure their kids get well educated as well and
then the generational shift is to more wealth rather than Welfare.

I think it might especially be applicable for those who don't choose to be

>homeless (i.e. they used to have jobs but COVID, lack of skills, the
>economy, etc., but them on the streets). For some of them, it might not
>even be a full college degree, as they may already have one, but simply
>some vocational training to bring their skills up to date.

The other thing is, in most areas there are jobs that require very
little equipment or education that these days seem to pay ridiculously
well because working people don't want to do it themselves, or have
gotten too old to do it.

I remember my mother trying to find a highschool kid who would
cut her grass. She was quite willing to pay $35 for what should
take 30 minutes to do, and it was hell trying to find anyone to
do it. In winter it would be clearing snow from walkways.

---
* SLMR Rob * I'm saving the GOOD Taglines for company
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More precisely, they don't want the mandate that hospitals must at least

>stablize any critical patient (of any legal status) that shows up at their
>facility... they cannot turn them away... to be nullified.

Yes, even ignoring illegals, you hear about people without insurance
dieing in hospital parking lots at times. The high cost of healthcare
causes a lot of issues in every country trying to supply it as a
social service for everyone, not just the rich.

Currently, hospitals are not allowed to turn critical patients away. They
have to be stablized first.

Yeah, you would have thought he or his cronies would have thought of that.

>Thing is, it is a talking point that gets his shrinking base excited...
>which apparently involves the potential death of anyone not of legal status

His popularity is dropping, is it?

Depends on who you listen to. Poll numbers are down, but others (i.e. supporters) will point to things that make it sound like he is as popular
as ever.

My nephew (in law?) was saying tonight how things were getting better
in the USA, and I was saying that's not what I seem to be hearing.
He also insists that anything I hear on the news is Fake News and
can't be believed so..

Does he live in the USA?

I simply said I haven't heard too many americans saying how their
cost of living is getting a lot cheaper since Trump took office..
(Correct me if I'm wrong..)

That is correct. Cost of living has not gone down... it has stablized
some, but the costs of many consumer goods, like food, are as high as they
ever were. Gasoline prices have fallen some throughout the year, which is
a plus.

The news here said the other night that most of the profits coming
in from Tariffs is going to reduce taxes for Millionaires, and
it's being paid for by the regular people, who are the ones who
pay the tariffs, not those who sell the products there.

Yes, it is a naive person who thinks that the tariff costs are not going to trickle down to us.

Mike


* SLMR 2.1a * Oooo, Better run, Mr. Wino!!!
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The other thing is, in most areas there are jobs that require very
little equipment or education that these days seem to pay ridiculously
well because working people don't want to do it themselves, or have
gotten too old to do it.

I have not checked into it, but someone I know who was looking for a part
time job learned that the local Kroger's (grocery chain) is looking for stockpeople at ~$18/hr starting pay.

I remember my mother trying to find a highschool kid who would
cut her grass. She was quite willing to pay $35 for what should
take 30 minutes to do, and it was hell trying to find anyone to
do it. In winter it would be clearing snow from walkways.

In the 1980s, when I was one of those kids, I would have been real pleased
to get $35 for a half-hour grass cutting job. I usually charged between $7-$10. :O

Mike

* SLMR 2.1a * Spelling is a sober man's game
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Rob Mccart wrote to KURT WEISKE <=-

I guess it's one of those things where you'd not know what would
happen until you tried it. Will it make them want to succeed or
just produce a well fed new batch of criminals?

Science says you're going to raise smarter kids with better mental
health and a better chance at success than kids left hungry without
positive influences.

There's a spectrum of people out there - some have dreams of a better
life, others may not. Providing nutrition and care to kids when they're
at their peak of development will help the former, and certainly
wouldn't harm the latter.




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It's a tough call, when you just know someone is a time bomb to

>> hurting or killing others but they haven't done so yet.

Possibly they would benefit from some psychiatric care, which

>> they would probably have to be forced into, and have the professionals
>> decide if/when they become safe to let loose on the streets..

Which is what I think they used to do.

Yes, probably.. but that is likely a lot more costly and we know
where that leads..

---
* SLMR Rob * Hey, this isn't my Tagline! - Who put this here?
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Yes, even ignoring illegals, you hear about people without insurance

>> dieing in hospital parking lots at times.

Currently, hospitals are not allowed to turn critical patients away. They

>have to be stablized first.

I realize that but you hear about very quick 'stabilizations' and
then the people sent on their way with instructions to head for a
state hospital for further treatment, and occasionally not making
it very far. I'm sure like with most things you can't paint them
all with the same brush but it's the bad ones that make the news.

Trump's popularity is dropping, is it?

Depends on who you listen to. Poll numbers are down, but others (i.e.

>supporters) will point to things that make it sound like he is as popular
>as ever.

You'll always hear that from supporters but I suppose it's not
all that critical as, barring a miracle, he will be gone in
not much more than 3 years.

My nephew (in law?) was saying tonight how things were getting better

>> in the USA, and I was saying that's not what I seem to be hearing.
>> He also insists that anything I hear on the news is Fake News and
>> can't be believed so..

Does he live in the USA?

No, he's up here in the Toronto area, but he's probably as close
to a Trump fan as you'd find in Canada..

I simply said I haven't heard too many americans saying how their

>> cost of living is getting a lot cheaper since Trump took office..
>> (Correct me if I'm wrong..)

That is correct. Cost of living has not gone down... it has stablized

>some, but the costs of many consumer goods, like food, are as high as they
>ever were. Gasoline prices have fallen some throughout the year, which is
>a plus.

I guess time will tell how well this is working. Gas prices dropped
some up here too so maybe can't be used as proof the plan is working.

The news here said the other night that most of the profits coming

>> in from Tariffs is going to reduce taxes for Millionaires, and
>> it's being paid for by the regular people, who are the ones who
>> pay the tariffs, not those who sell the products there. n

Yes, it is a naive person who thinks that the tariff costs are not going to

>trickle down to us.

It's not quite a trickle down. If Trump puts a 25% tariff on a product
coming into the USA, your cost to buy it instantly goes up by 25%..

A Tariff is just another word for a Tax paid by the consumers..

---
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The other thing is, in most areas there are jobs that require very

>> little equipment or education that these days seem to pay ridiculously
>> well because working people don't want to do it themselves, or have
>> gotten too old to do it.

I have not checked into it, but someone I know who was looking for a part

>time job learned that the local Kroger's (grocery chain) is looking for
>stockpeople at ~$18/hr starting pay.

Yes, and that's a fairly regular type job. Doing 'grunt work' type
things seems to pay very well these days, although you can't do
that your whole life since it often involves some heavy work.

But I think even allowing for travel (walking) time between calls,
a kid could buy a push lawn mower in the city and probably make
$40 or $50 an hour cutting lawns after school.

I remember my mother trying to find a highschool kid who would

>> cut her grass. She was quite willing to pay $35 for what should
>> take 30 minutes to do, and it was hell trying to find anyone to
>> do it. In winter it would be clearing snow from walkways.

In the 1980s, when I was one of those kids, I would have been real pleased

>to get $35 for a half-hour grass cutting job. I usually charged between
>$7-$10. :O

Ha.. Not quite the same thing but I remember when I was about 12
taking on cutting the grass at home for an extra 75 cents a week
on my allowance.. This was on a small hobby farm we had with close
to an acre of grass around the house to cut with a push mower.

Push as in a gas engine mower but not a riding tractor/mower.

I remember cutting my grandfathers small lawn using a true push
mower that had no engine, the spiral blades spun as you pushed it.

I didn't want to confuse it with that type.. B)

---
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I guess it's one of those things where you'd not know what would
happen until you tried it. Will it make them want to succeed or
just produce a well fed new batch of criminals?

Science says you're going to raise smarter kids with better mental

> health and a better chance at success than kids left hungry without
> positive influences.

There's a spectrum of people out there - some have dreams of a better

> life, others may not. Providing nutrition and care to kids when they're
> at their peak of development will help the former, and certainly
> wouldn't harm the latter.

One would hope so.. I think there's a major problem when kids are
growing up in a very poor income area where, even if they are
better looked after than others, there will still be peer pressure
to be like everyone around you or you get beat up at school a lot.

But I don't know if people removed from that hear the true story.
You seem to always see on TV shows and such that even the good kids
are being forced to join gangs and sell drugs and such and most
dropping out of school long before they could even think about any
higher education.

Plus you get the impression that a lot of these kids don't have
a father at home and a mother working 3 jobs to keep food on
the table so no one around to keep an eye on what the kids are
doing after school, or if they are even going to school.

There's no question, if you can break a kid out of that situation
there's an excellent chance that his children will then be more
likely to do well too and you end up with generational prosperity
rather than poverty.

I won't pretend to know this stuff inside out but my parents
worked harder and got better educations, getting degrees in
night school while working, and they ended up pretty well off
where most of their siblings did not. Those siblings are very
vocal about how our prosperity was because we were just lucky.

Move forward 50 years and we have 2 more generations and
all are fairly well off. Every generation usually does better
than the previous one *if they taught that hard work = success*..

I added that last part because I recently read that people
who inherit huge amounts of money, over 60% of them are often
bankrupt within 2 generations and that rises to 90% within
3 generations. This is the problem with just handing people
money that they didn't have to work hard to earn..

---
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Ha.. Not quite the same thing but I remember when I was about 12
taking on cutting the grass at home for an extra 75 cents a week
on my allowance.. This was on a small hobby farm we had with close
to an acre of grass around the house to cut with a push mower.

Push as in a gas engine mower but not a riding tractor/mower.

I remember cutting my grandfathers small lawn using a true push
mower that had no engine, the spiral blades spun as you pushed it.

I didn't want to confuse it with that type.. B)

I always considered "push" to mean the ones with an engine that you had to stand behind and push, and "reel" to mean the ones with no engine. I own
both. I have never owned or used a riding mower.

I bought the reel mower after I got my first house. It had a fairly small front yard. I liked being able to mow the grass without breathing in the exhaust. It would work on the backyard, too, but was more difficult to use there because the terrain was not smooth... I suspect there was not much
dirt on top of rock (a few of which stuck out of the ground).

For that front yard, provided I was able to stay on top of it and not let the weeds get too tall, it was less work using the reel mower than the
gas-powered one.

Mike

* SLMR 2.1a * We all live in a yellow subroutine.
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Push as in a gas engine mower but not a riding tractor/mower.

I remember cutting my grandfathers small lawn using a true push

>> mower that had no engine, the spiral blades spun as you pushed it.

I didn't want to confuse it with that type.. B)

I always considered "push" to mean the ones with an engine that you had to

>stand behind and push, and "reel" to mean the ones with no engine. I own
>both. I have never owned or used a riding mower.

That sounds better, more clear. I think we called it that back in the
day too, although I haven't seen one of those in over 50 years.

For that front yard, provided I was able to stay on top of it and not let the

>weeds get too tall, it was less work using the reel mower than the
>gas-powered one.

They did work rather well. When I was using my grandfather's reel mower
I was probably only 9 or 10 years old..

---
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